well said, well said. I don't know though...that one "Misterslippi River Race" song was always a little iffy... :-)

The whole music debate in Christian circles is just dumb. That's about the only thing I can say about it anymore.

What's even better is that I've heard the lyrics set to RAP. Actually, 'Amazing Grace' works rather well too...

The Christian/Pirate dichotomy was always a stumbling block for me.

slig, give it up. this post is merely a distraction tactic designed to make us forget your sweetest, darkest secrets...what it is you do on sunday mornings to "prepare your heart." (we all have our vices, and the CCM is only one that starts with "c," pal.) we are so onto you.

Joy, people get hurt when you go around throwing out accusations like rogue Molotov cocktails. Your accusations are based on purely circumstantial evidence. Sure, the tabloids frequently report alleged sightings of me at Starbucks and Port City, but there's not one shred of evidence, not one shred.

I don't know if you've been looking at the same sites I have, but some of these guys need to take themselves a little less seriously. They argue with sneers and view their despair over the culture in our churches as a sign that they alone understand how bad it really is. Anyone who disagrees is treated like an unsophisticated rube.

I think their only comfort is that there are still some pre-Vatican II services out there that they can attend.

Ted, it sounds like we've probably been reading the same sites...

gentlemen, i know it's viewed as a cop-out approach, but i guarantee it's healthier for those irritible ulcers if you'll just follow my method: avoid these sites entirely. it's the beauty of blogs. everyone from suicidal monks to navel-gazing chumps can spout their guts to the worldwide web, but you--you don't have to read it. i love that about the web. i'm gloriously free from the bondage of those who would put me under what i consider to be the equivalent of musical kjv-only-ism. one way i manage this real or imagined detachment is to simply eschew their esoteric threads and weave where the Lord has placed me...which tends to be in humbler, grittier, less renown, and YET STRANGELY LESS DISSONANT contexts.

Actually, I took that route long ago. I just went back to the site just out of curiosity. When I browsed the forum topics I suddenly remembered why I had stopped reading it long ago.

I'm with Ben.

Pirates as Christians? Pirates as singing Christians? Pirates as little boys and girls with white sashes singing on intermittent Sunday nights?

I'm in the initial stages of marketing a whole line of Christian-themed criminals. So far I have songs and stories for Ricky the Rum-Runner, Darrel the Dimebag-Peddler, Nevin the Nazi, and Sheila the Shoplifter.

Or to add to your last sentence...
READ YOUR BIBLE

i'm a pirate

Wow. Unbelievable. Them mates should just avast or something.

Whoa

I cannot believe this arguement. I stumbled upon this website on accident and I am completely appalled with this "discussion". Pirates cant be Christians? What kind of Christians are you to argure with a man doing God's work. Who are YOU to decide how God wants things portrayed? This makes me sick to my stomach. I think I am going to have to say a prayer for some of you. Humble yourselves and stop being so "high and mighty".

I think some little pirate needs to take a chill pill.

Those of you who r sayin a pirate as a Christian? I have a couple of words to say. 1. The Bible teaches that God wants all to come unto him. If he didn`t then he would not have commanded the saved to GO YE INTO ALL THE WORLD AND PREACH THE GOSPEL. And if God Himself the all MIGHTY didnt want anyone to come to him for salvation then he would not have sent Jesus Christ to die on the cross for our sins cause we are all as filthy rags as the book of Isiah teaches us we all deserve hell Romans 3:23 For ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God. 2. I have seen tons of young children get saved through the ministry that Ron Hamilton started. And tons inspired through the powerful words that God worked through him to write them touching sings! Before you go and talk about Ron Hamilton read his story of how he became known as patch the pirate!then lets see if u want to continue to talk! and also his music is not ccm i have never heard his songs sang at a contempary church and believe me i grew up in a contempary church but now am attending a Bible believeing fundamental Independent Baptist Church ! so Ron Hamilton is not ccm! and if you would like to continue this discussion then feel free to email me at [email protected]

1. I came upon this site by accident and I can't believe how some people can call Ron Hamilton a pirate because they don't like his music. So he has to wear an eyepatch, does he? He is one of the most brilliant musical minds our generation of Christian fundamentalists have been gifted with. That's a bit unkind, don't you think? You know that people who wear eyepatches probably do so for very valid reasons, pirates or not. It's easy to lose an eye's functionality because of inborn defects, disease, or accident. When such things happen to an eye, its owner may choose to leave it exposed, making him look freakish to some people, or to hide it under an eyepatch - something he has every right to do.

2. About pirates: they are not the worst of people. During the Ages of Exploration and High Imperialism, around 1600-1890s that is, European monarchs sanctioned private individuals eager for plunder and glory to raid and destroy a rival kingdom's shipping. To avoid the disgrace of exposure if their privateers got caught, governments didn't remunerate them but allowed them a handsome share of the loot. The English called their privateers "buccaneers", the Dutch called theirs "vrijbuiter" (where you got the term "freebooter" and "filibustero" [Spanish, Filipino]), the Russians had their Cossacks who did the same exploits overland, and now we know them as simply "pirates". Much has been said about their ruthlessness and violence, but beneath it was a strong desire for individual freedom and glory. Indeed, the word "filibustero" described, not pirates in the Spanish empire, but revolutionaries.

3. "Now, for didactic purposes, I've selected the simplest Ron Hamilton song I could possibly find, which I'm going to compare to the most complex hymn I could find, one which delves into no fewer than 14 theological categories and which uses multiple theological terms with more than 5 syllables. As you can see, most of Ron Hamilton's lyrics don't go beyond tri-syllabic words. And he doesn't use the terms propitiation or hypostatic union even once. Separation time, folks."

So goes a Ron Hamilton critic. It seems that in this critic's view, the shorter the words, the more a song leans in the direction of CCM. But does this reflect the Logic of the King James Version Bible? Pick a book. Read a chapter. Look closely at the words. Count their syllables. How many words go beyond three syllables? There are probably more monosyllabic words than polysyllabic words in that chapter. You may want to compare your chapter from a line of Shakespeare or Milton too.

Also, large groups of people speaking the same language tend to simplify by shortening the words. Sometimes they form contractions (I'll, can't, ako'y) or simply fuse two words together (rainbow). They even create totally new words like email (electronic mail) and tip (To Insure Promptness).

Short words, therefore, are a mark of good English, but also of contemporary English. (There's that word again!) But the "contemporary" of English is different from the "contemporary" of CCM. Come to think of it, a lot of unquestionably Christian music is contemporary - whoever wrote and/or composed them are still alive and active in the music ministry. But what makes CCM "contemporary" is the tunes that go with them - rock tunes. The genre they belong to came into existence during the 1950s, when the world was war-weary and the youth were upset with their high and mighty elders who they thought were responsible for the war just ended and the wars then in rage. The music they designed revealed their rebellion for everything their elders stood for: order, high musical standards, high moral standards, everything that the youth saw as fake.

Rock music is a genre designed to be rebellious, or even anarchistic. That is why "Christian Rock" (and in that sense, "Contemporary Christian Music") is really oxymoronic - you can't just plug in Christian words into a rock tune and expect the product to bring glory to God. But - my point is, rock, "Christian" rock, "Contemporary Christian" music is distinguished primarily by its TUNE. And Ron Hamilton does not use any such tunes in his songs. Even his language, as I have discussed, is correct.

It only remains to be added that his critic, and critics of this wavelength, must believe that Victorian English is the best kind of English there is for all eternity. Not true. Standards are good, but the Earth does move, it moves all the same.

4. By the way, what's wrong with Starbucks?

5. I am a Filipino living in the Philippines. Fundamental churches here listen to Hamilton's music, among others. Not many of us know how he looks like; I saw his picture for the first time just last night; but Christian fundamentalists and even other Baptists here have been blessed by his songs. They have been used in Church anniversaries, Bible Conferences, and other venues of fellowship among our brethren. Why? Because we are all aware of the power God can work through his music. I guess you can say that in a way, Hamilton really is a pirate in thrall with glory - God's glory - and freedom - the freedom to boundlessly worship Him in His terms, and His terms alone.

Bahhh...

Vikings are the new Pirates...

Activist,
Thanks for your thoughts.

Sorry if there's been a misunderstanding. I don't think any of the commenters are genuinely criticizing the "Pirate" part of Ron Hamilton, and certainly none of the commenters would ever be so crude as to make fun of his disability. I guess you have to know those commenters; I think they were just being silly.

So there aren't any Darrel the Dime-Bag Peddler CD's coming out!?! Those kids are gonna be crushed.

I have grown up listening to Ron Hamilton aka Patch the Pirate. I believe that his music is not even close to being CCM. I personally have met him and have his signature. His songs have a wonderful message of basic Bible principles that even a little child can understand.

The reason why Ron Hamilton portrays a pirate, is
because after his eye was removed, due to cancer,
he wore an eye patch. Then one day a boy asked
him if he was a pirate or something. He told the boy no, but that question gave him an idea as to
how to reach out to young children for Christ.

I think it's just evil to make the True and living Son of God ino a cartoon character. I love ron's songs tho' for the most part...

I think that all of you are totally losing the point of Ron Hamilton's music. His purpose in every word is to proclaim Christ's love for us. Not to promote Pirate's as Christians, or any other secret vendetta.
And if all you can do is sit here and bicker over stupid things like that, then you really need to sit back and take a good long look at yourself.

you all need to stop being panzies and just listen to Christina Hard Rock!

oh wait now I just opened a major can of worms didn't I?

well guess what, LOVE JESUS CHRIST above all!

that is what really matters, then love others, and

guess what comes last, you!

try out some bands like: Disciple, Skillet, The Glorious Unseen, Spoken

oh wait you all will surely label them as "of the Devil" because they use electric guitars and drums which obviously were crafted by the DEVIL himself...

Last time I checked Scripture true worshipers, worship God in spirit and in truth.

I have personally met Ron Hamilton a few times back in the 80s at a camp called the Wilds. I also met him at a church function during the same time period.

I can tell you that he has been one of the most inspiring persons that I have ever met in my christian life. His ministry has made a difference in thousands of lifes.

While his music may seem too contemporary for some, I don't see a problem with it. As long as the song is about god or how we should live as Christians, it is fine with me.

I personally havn't listened to much of Ron Hamilton's music, so I wouldn't know if it was CCM or not. But most of these arguments are just totally pragmatic: "if it has good results it is good." No, if it follows the Word of God it is good. If his music is opposed to the Bible then it is not good music. If it is Biblical, then it is good music. Enough said.
Oh, and pirates were murderors, (privateers, such as Sir Francis Drake, were not pirates) so they cannot be Christians. Sure God wants them to be saved, but its not like people are born pirates. It's a choice.

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